Trey: Hello and welcome back to another
episode of MCU Need to Know a podcast

dedicated to the Marvel Cinematic
Universe and everything you need to know.

I'm Trey.

Jude: I'm Jude.

How was your trip Trey?

Trey: Man, it was so good.

It was, I was telling you earlier,
it feels weird to be back now

because we were supposed to be
recording about 30 minutes ago.

But I think I forgot how to set up
my, my recording set up because I had

just been in full on vacation mode.

Like even though I'm back, I'm not

back.

Jude: It's okay.

Well it's weird.

You came back.

No weird, but well,

Trey: It is weird.

I came back.

I was fleeing the country, so

I'm not a great criminal
if I came back to the

Jude: scene of the crime.

Oh man.

So for me, you know, I'm off all week.

My school is off our week.

The kids have been off all week
and he's been off all week.

And so it's like, it's weird.

Cause I'm like you came
back from vacation.

To the holidays and being off, but you
didn't come back to actually being off.

So I know you had today and I know
you'll get tomorrow for those we're

recording on Thursday, Thanksgiving day
in the U S uh, so yeah, so it's so in

my head first for a second, it's like
he came back from vacation to being off

on the holidays, but you actually went,

Trey: oh, no, I went right to work.

Uh, you know, I tried to plan it where,
where it would be easier at work.

Cause it's the slow season for me at work.

So things aren't growing as fast.

What I didn't anticipate was that
I was coming back to a three-day

workweek because of Thanksgiving.

So these first three days were wild,
but luckily we got through it and I

got these two days to rest and yeah.

And I'm excited to be back, man.

I want to say, first of all, thank
you to friend Daniel and Amity

for joining us or joining you.

I should say joining the podcast
in the two weeks I was gone,

they did a really wonderful job.

And thanks to you because those
episodes were really good, man.

And it was so much fun to get that audio.

Perspective of this show.

Jude: Yeah.

I'm glad you enjoyed that part because
like, I even waited to schedule it for,

um, you know, our transition with it.

We used transistor and
I waited to schedule it.

So you wouldn't even be tempted to peak.

Uh, I didn't upload any of the audio to
the drive, all of my computer, you know?

And when I, when I named it on
remotely for those I didn't name the

episodes, I just named the guest.

So even if you looked at the
email or anything, I tried to

keep it completely in the dark.

So when you listened, I totally looked

Trey: at the email.

I feel so called

Jude: out.

Trey: Oh man, I will say this though.

It was, it was a weird habit when, cause
I was over there for one of the Sundays,

which Sunday is when I normally am running
through all my transistor double checks

to make sure everything's scheduled.

And it was like, I found myself
reflexively, opening, transistor, and

being like, Nope, I can't do this.

This isn't what I'm supposed to do.

And then I came back home on a
Sunday, but that Saturday I had

it in my head that it was Sunday.

So again, I kept like reflexively opening,

but uh, but yeah, seriously, a
really great job on those episodes.

And again, thank you to you and friend
Daniel Amity for, for doing this and.

Yeah, it was a lot of fun.

Yeah.

Well, if you downloaded this episode,
you know that we are going to be talking

about season one episode, one of Hawkeye,
and you know, every time we start a

new season of the Disney plus shows,
it's always fun to reiterate what we do

here for any potential new listeners.

So the way that we're going to
handle this is every episode.

This season, we are going to have
some pre spoiler thoughts, which

is a place for us to discuss the
episode without getting into spoilers.

So if you're not quite caught up
yet, this is a place for you to get a

taste of the episode free of spoilers.

After we go through those, you'll hear
an audio cue, which will bring us into

the spoiler zone and it will be fair
game for all spoilers once we get there.

And the other thing I wanted to make
note for those who have been listening,

we are now past the shonky threshold.

It is now part of the spoiler zone.

So any potential discussions
may involve that as well

Jude: for new listeners, the threshold,
uh, for the, for those movies.

So a turtle's a steer books is still.

And the spoiler, um, free area, uh,
mainly because we're waiting for these

movies to hit Disney plus streaming.

So

Trey: the way that we handle
that is people have a.

After, oh, they have a week to
watch it once it hits Disney plus.

And that's when it will be in the spoiler

Jude: zone.

Yeah.

And I would say one last
thing to new listeners.

We're a show like this Hawkeye,
um, because of, you know, being

Thanksgiving, having two episodes,
we probably won't start this full

on until about episode three.

Although previous listeners know now
how we do it, we also will read first

reaction responses to episodes that
we get out of social media when you

reply to our pre spoiler thoughts.

So if you want to hear your appreciable,
their thoughts at the end, make

sure to interact on that end and
be on the lookout for the polls

again, to vote on episode titles.

Trey: Yeah.

So it's going to be a little
bit weird this week just because

we have two episodes dropping.

Uh, but yeah.

Good call on that.

That will go back to a
regular schedule next week.

With all of that being said a
buckle, then we're going to dive

into some Hawkeye season one
episode, one, never meet your heroes.

So Jude, what are your pre
spoiler thoughts for this first?

Epic?

Jude: My pre spoiler thoughts.

I'm going to start by
reading what I sent you.

And it's not a hard text to find
because I use the spoiler ink.

So, because I didn't know if you'd
read it if you'd seen it yet.

Um, I mean, Thanksgiving is kind of weird
our routine of when we watch episodes

have been thrown off a little bit.

Um, and so for those of you who didn't
get to see my response on social

media, I'm going to start with that.

Hawkeye was a well paced.

I'm sorry.

It was a well paced blend totally of
Netflix is Daredevil in the MCU yet.

I already catch myself dreading
that'll be two episodes, two shorts.

Um, and that's kind of a hold over for
some of the other Disney plus shows.

The Falcon and the winter soldier
low-key and just kind of wanting

to more episodes to kind of really.

Uh, give them some room to breathe in
and do this in and tell her that not

that they were bad stories, but to tell
their story, uh, otherwise like, I, I

really, really enjoyed these, these, um,
I think the biggest compliment I can give

is wishing I could see episode three.

Trey: Yeah, I feel

Jude: that.

Yeah.

And you preach for their thoughts.

Trey: Yeah.

Playing, uh, I'll I'll follow suit here
and read the priest for the thought

that I shared on social media with the
caveat being that part of mine does

pertain episode two, but I'll reiterate
that once we get to the second episode

coverage, You know, I had this feeling
that there's a clunkiness to the

episodes, but there's also sincerity and
charm that more than makes up for it.

Uh, in episode two, there's a
particular topic about branding that

makes me feel like the clunkiness
that I'm feeling may be by design.

So I am looking forward to more
and looking forward to explaining

some of my feelings on that once
we get into the spoiler zone.

And as far as that feeling of wanting
episode three, I think they've done a

really good job of wanting to jump you
into the next episode, because even the

way this one ends is a great lead in
for what we get into in episode two.

So there, this feels like one of
the complaints I had about Falcon

in the winter soldier was the,
this feels like a movie that's

been cut up less so of a series.

And this feels like a written for TV show.

So yes, it feels, it feels good in that.

Natural in that segment.

Well, I

Jude: believe this is the first
one where we've had multiple

Trey: directors.

Oh, see, I didn't even
pay attention to that.

That's great.

See, I

Jude: think, I think moon Knight is
going to have multiple directors, but

I think this had multiple, multiple
directors, like your typical TV show,

show runner, multiple directors,
and the other three have not.

Trey: That's good to know.

And one more point on
my preschooler thoughts.

Uh, I think another nice thing about
this episode is how it unites Kate

and Clint through the lens of hero
admiration and what that experience

is like for the both of them.

So another thing that I'm looking forward
to, uh, getting into in the spoiler zone.

Yeah.

Well, unless we got any more, I
think we can go ahead and jump in.

Yeah, let's do it.

All right.

Like we said, you're gonna hear an audio
cue and on the other side it will be

fair game for all spoilers in the MCU.

We'll see you on the other side.

And we're back.

So another way that we do this is
once we're into the spoiler zone and

we're going to be breaking the episode
down into the most important topics.

This is a way for us to kind of
parse through the episode while not

necessarily going scene by scene,
but hitting the highest points and

branching off wherever we need to.

So the first point I want to make
is I'm so happy to be able to do the

most important topics again, after
taking a break from what if with that?

And yeah, it's just, it was
so fun to sit down and try and

break this episode down that way.

And the second point being the most
important topic we're going to start

with now is simply Kate Bishop.

So this will be the section for
us to discuss the way they've

introduced this character and how
she has proceeded through this

episode in her standalone scenes.

So Jude, where would you like
to start within this section?

Jude: I'm got distracted and I'm
going to start somewhere completely

different and I'll come back.

I said the thing about the directors and
I just wanted to check it is, um, the, the

same director for the first two episodes.

And this director looks like it's
doing episode six and there's another

director doing the other, basically.

So your episode one and two
and six have the same director.

Okay.

And then the bookend of three, four,
and five will have the same director.

So it's only two directors and they're

Trey: doing that.

Well, you know what?

I was going to save this for stray
thoughts, but I'll throw this in

here while we're here at the top.

Did you notice this?

I think is the first time we
saw a Kevin flakey production.

Jude: I

Trey: didn't notice that.

I think it's the first time I've never
seen it before, but it definitely

stood out to me during this one.

Yeah.

I

Jude: didn't notice that,

you

Trey: know, it's good.

He's finally getting some recognition.

Jude: He was just, you know what,
it's part of our listener base.

Right?

Kevin he needs the recognition
that the rest of them get right

well-deserved recognition.

Uh, no.

So to jump back on the topic, um, I love.

The first well, okay.

So I had some weird things with Kate's
first sequence, but the sequence

where we have the older Kate, right.

Where she's shooting off the arrow
at the bell tower clock tower.

Yep.

Okay.

That sequence, I really, really loved
how so it was one of those things that.

I felt like it to go back
to our devil Daredevil days.

I feel like it was very economical.

Like we learned a lot about
Kate Bishop right there.

This went to pick the lock,
but couldn't and was able to

climb the bill, the building.

Right.

Um, we found very quickly
like, okay, she's fearless.

Um, she's accomplished with a boat.

Uh, willing to take risks, you know?

And so, and so those first few moments
we learned a lot of this character,

uh, we just, again, subtle things of
just actions of picking the locks.

So it's like, okay, you
know what you're doing?

But even though you didn't
do it, you're right.

You know that wasn't going to stop you.

Uh, so that, that's one thing I
really liked about this character

or, and how they showed us this
character in the beginning.

Trey: Yeah, I definitely, yeah.

I agree with you in the ways that
this episode has been economical.

You know, I keep coming back
to this feeling of clunkiness.

I will play off of what you said, but
I want to establish this first based on

that scene of her climbing the middle.

She definitely should have just
been admiring Scott laying, I

think a little more than Hawkeye.

Cause she climbed up just as fast as
he did in the first ant man movie.

And to go to bat for her, if the bell and
that tower is destroyed from one arrow,

I don't think that's on her OSHA needs
to get involved here with this school

and what's going on with this building?

Jude: Hmm.

I want to say you're wrong,

but honestly, I don't know
if I can write like one.

It does you're right.

It does feel like one
big strong gust of wind.

Yeah.

Moves that thing.

But see, at that point, at
that point, it's an act of God.

Right.

Like, like, and I, and I, and I
don't see that like jokingly it's

like the insurance language, you
know, store and act of God kind of

thing versus like a person doing it.

Um, it's very different.

Trey: And if we went a good technical,
technically two arrow, she hit the

bell and then she hit the draw.

Jude: Well, it was a safety
cord and she cut the cord.

And

Trey: I don't know, I just
want it on the record.

I am going to bat for Kate Bishop
here, but uh, no going, getting

back on topic, you know, you,
you brought up being economical.

There is a scene later on where Kate
is speaking to her mother, Eleanor,

and they're talking about going
to the charity event and it's the.

Um, playful back and forth between
Eleanor being the mother role and

also being the I'm your friend role.

And there's a line where Kate
says something like, you know,

I, I got, oh, no, I'm sorry.

It's the mother Eleanor says you
got your black belt at 18 and or 15.

And that felt like it stood
out a little bit the way.

They demonstrate characterization better
is in the subtlety of the moms saying

like, okay, well you just go put on
that red dress and meet me at the event.

Next scene, we see she's in that black
suit that I think speaks more to Kate's

character than some of those clunky
lines that they're throwing into, which

I can use the circle is back to the very
beginning of the episode with the, and

I'll cut them some slack because child
actors, you know, there there's a range of

skill there, but you know, they're dead.

They're trying, there was a
scene where young Kate was

like, I need a bow and arrow.

And there was something about that line
that just stood out to me too, of like,

okay, I don't know if, um, this is working
for me, but I'm giving it a long runway.

If that makes sense.

Jude: I know that I get that.

Uh, I mean, I mean the whole setup
for her character was interesting.

Um, you know, like, like I get
it, you're that little kid in

your witnesses event and you see.

This person fighting.

Right.

And, and that becomes your hero, right?

Like I want to be that person.

So I get that.

And so for me, the whole, I want a bow
and arrow didn't I want to bow in here.

That whole line made sense.

I think the time and place
at dad's funeral was weird.

If that makes sense.

Like that's the clunk.

Yeah.

And it's, and it's your yeah.

And that I can totally get, cause it
there's an element of, well, if you

add an extra scene for just that long.

Elsewhere, you get some more character
development, but you're eating into

runtime and is more efficient just to
find a way to do it here, you know?

And so I get that the, in the choices.

Um, so yeah, so I dunno, it goes
back and forth and I just found

it interesting that that whole.

I honestly, that whole not being able
to find her parents, I thought it was

weird because in my head that's going on.

I'm like, where are my kids?

You know?

Uh, I'm I'm like immediately
where my kids were looking for

the kids kind of, kind of thing.

And so not being able to find the
parents, I thought it was weird.

Um, and the first watch, I was really
expecting Kate to wake up from a dream

or in like, or like in some therapy
session, recalling childhood memories.

Um, and, and that's okay
that, that didn't happen.

And this next thought is
that larger episode thought.

But, but you know, the, the, the going
back to this moment and what that

means for the universal and whole, I
think is, is something worth exploring,

um, in a, in another topic episode,

Trey: Okay.

You know, I, I do want to
say something positive.

Cause I feel like I am being a little
critical of the 2012 perspective.

Something I really enjoyed is the way, you
know, they, they put the 2012 timestamp

at the very beginning of that episode.

So you immediately will connect that to
the Avengers, but I thought they did a

pretty good job of taking away that fear
that I have and really enveloping the.

Family life.

Like by the time, like I had almost
forgotten about it and till we see

the tuttare fly by the window, and
I thought they did a very good job

of making you feel that sense of
security and then ripping it out from

under you in such a short timeframe.

But the thing that I want to put the most
praise on is the interaction between Kate

and her dad was full of sincerity that
echos the way Clint treated Wanda and age

of Ultron, where they have that famous
scene where Hawkeye says, like, if you

step out that door, you're an Avenger.

And essentially mimicking
what Kate's dad says about.

The only thing we control is the choices
we make in the face of uncertainty.

So I thought if these are characters that
are going to be linked up together, it

is very wonderful that the foundation
for which Kate stands on is that the

choices we make in the face of uncertainty
and it feels like it's primed to.

Pair her with Clint.

Jude: Yeah, no, that's, that's
a really good, uh, catch there.

Um, I there's a review.

I didn't read because I
wanted to do this first.

I want to go back to it.

And it mentioned, um, Hawkeye
superpower who is being a dad.

And that was the headline.

I was like, oh, that looks fascinating.

I want to read that.

Um, I haven't read it.

But, but that reminds me of
you starting that relationship.

They built with Wanda, their
relationship to the dad relationship.

Or as my oldest would say, oh,
it's another NCU, another dad show.

Um, it was their first reaction
at the start of Chung G like,

like who is that as well?

That's his dad.

Oh yeah.

But like, that's, you know, that's,
uh, uh, that's a good catch though.

Like, like you have that, uh, that
drive in that memory, um, and it's

kind of fitting, you know, the title
of the show never meet your heroes.

Right.

Um, cause you, you, um, God, I'm going
to get off topic for just a moment.

Same thing with miss Marvel.

I'm curious to what they do
because in the comic she's a

superhero fan loves captain Marvel.

Uh, Carol Danvers and has a moment
in the comic where it's like, I

built up Carol Danvers to be this.

And I finally get to meet them
and was like, oh, you're a

human, you have human problems.

You're not just a super superhero.

Uh, and, and so I, and I, and it's
interesting that that buildup of

like, that they're doing with a
lot of different characters towards

Clint, but Kate in particular of
building Hawkeye Clint into this.

And he's just like, dude, I
just, you mess things up for me.

I want to go to my family.

Trey: You know, I want to add one more
thing, uh, by circling back towards Kate

and Eleanor, I really enjoy their dynamic.

I talked about it a little bit
where it feels like Eleanor, who

is played by a Vera for Minga,
who was an incredible actor.

Uh, she has a great job of going between
the I'm your mother, but I can also

be your friend role, like not in a way
that feels patronizing and really feels

like us a flip back and forth as needed
for whatever moment has come forward.

And in particular, the line that I
really enjoyed was about how young people

and rich people both feel invincible.

And you have been both your entire life.

I haven't, you're not invincible.

I thought that was a really good
way to kind of put Kate in her

place in such a firm manner.

And I thought that was really well done.

Jude: Yeah.

I really liked that, especially because
it was a payoff moment for something

that happened within the opening seconds,
you know, they're, they're talking about

when I say they, uh, Kate's parents
back in 2012, over the argument is over

money and she was to sell the penthouse.

And it's clear through that argument
that they can't struggling with

finances, not being able to afford it.

And so that line, I think of now don't
get me wrong, like prices of New York and

the place that they had makes me wonder
what kind of money struggles they had

just cause like, like, was it nefarious
in other words that, you know what I mean?

Just cause like, you know, reality, they
had a really big house, you know, and

Trey: it's like, we
gotta sell the penthouse.

Here's my tiny

violin.

Jude: Yeah.

Um, but it, but it did kind of
clue me in of like, okay, you

know, this is character shut up.

Maybe is it something nefarious
that there we gotta get out of this.

Um, but that whole issue of money
wanting to sell the penthouse.

Um, I think that, that this moment
here of saying, Hey, I have not always

been rich was a payoff from this,
you know, and just kind of her dry.

To, to have these things and to have a
certain life coming off of the, those

events of 2012 and that argument it's very

Trey: grounding.

Yes.

For all the characters involved.

Yes.

And the final thing I want to say about
the relationship, we have a moment

at the charity event where our Monda
third, who is as subtle as a brick

drops, the news that Eleanor and Jack
are engaged, and Kate is incredibly

upset about this and she'd storms up to
her mom and her mom asks, is there any

part of you that could be happy for me?

And despite the fact that she's
so upset, she's puts aside

her anger is like, yes, yes.

And you know, I'm sorry.

So even though they're clearly
at odds, there's still a strong

enough relationship that they can
express their dissatisfaction with

each other and still move forward.

And, uh, that feels like a
really healthy relationship.

Jude: Kinda okay.

Oh, well, I mean, there is an element
of like, that's not the best way

to find out your mom's engaged.

Trey: Nope.

And it's not the best way to
handle it, either Kate storms up,

Jude: but they weren't yet they
worked through it in the moment.

You're right.

So we'll see.

Trey: Yeah.

I got some predictions that will make
this seem obsolete by the time we get to,

Jude: so we'll see.

Trey: Oh man.

Well, I think that's going to do
it for our Kate Bishop section.

So, uh, I'm gonna go ahead and
move us into the next, most

important topic, which is.

Clint Barton, the titular
character himself.

This section is going to be to describe
all his scenes, the characterizations

that they're doing with them here,
specifically with his trips to the

Rogers musical, uh, his scenes with
his family, and eventually getting

wrapped up in the mess of the suit.

So starting with me this time, I think
the clear place to start is the musical

man, what a disturbing and uncanny
depiction of the events of the 2012 movie.

And it's such a weird contrast, which
I mean, it's for effect, but it's such

a weird contrast in the way the episode
opens up in 2012 and we see the harsh

realities of what Kate has experienced.

And then we come to the present and
somebody who was there with Clint

is having to relive this through.

It's not, it's not even disrespectful.

It's just tasteless, I guess,
is the word I'm looking for.

But.

When I think about it in essence,
the audience in that room is no

different than us and the entertainment
value that they got from, from

these quote unquote real events.

But it's a wild perspective
to be pushed out of that.

Once you're sitting there with Hawkeye
watching this, if that makes sense.

Jude: Okay.

How many years removed is this music?

From those events?

Trey: Uh, it was 2012 and it's oh, and
world is 2012 and they're at 20, 24 now.

Jude: So math that's 10, 23 years.

Yeah.

Um, the movie world trade
center came out in 2006.

Yeah.

Trey: Yeah, I know.

So when somebody,

Jude: and what, when
did United 93 come out?

Trey: Oh, I'm not sure.

Apparently there is a, a musical
about nine 11 tier, which it's not

necessarily strictly about nine 11,
but it's a big framing device for

Jude: that musical.

Yeah.

Both of, both of those United 93 in
world trade center came out in 2006.

So it's just you're right.

And it's interesting commentary.

I think of like what we do with media.

What is appropriate time, you know, I
mean, cause the destruction of that and

the, of that incident, putting ourselves
in world, how far removed until you

start doing, what cultures do you tell
your stories of heroes, you memorialize

them, you know, um, in, in various ways.

And so, you know, especially with the
Sokovia Accords and you know, staying

in world and there's this whole.

You know, is there a pushback?

Is there not?

And so that I find really fascinating.

Um, what I do like that they did
with this was they were able to with

sound show how Barton was feeling
and, you know, and have this.

Cause you think like he's having like this
PTSD moment watching this and he kind of

is, but he's also tuning it out literally.

You know, and have this ridiculousness.

And so I just loved how they, how
they did that, you know, and how

he's like that guy wasn't even there.

Like,

you know, and it's funny, cause
he's the one that got hit man

and brought him to Germany.

He was like, he would know
for sure he wasn't even there.

Trey: And you know, you know, that's
a detail that would be stretched for a

drama to station just to make it fit, to
get as many people in there as you could.

Jude: Oh

Trey: yeah.

But you know, and I want to highlight, you
talked about how they used sound to show

as a where Clint Barton is emotionally,
even the way they get us there.

Textually the song has aligned
when it says like, and with ant

man, you won't hear a sound and
it's it fades out on that part.

And that's where we get the revelation
that Clint has turned off his earpiece.

Yeah, it's it's really well done.

And another thing they're doing here,
not only in the sense of this is a

tragedy that has been turned into a play.

And here is somebody who was
there having to relive it through

this fantastical depiction.

He's having to face seeing Natasha
and seeing this little girl that's

dressed up, like her, seeing her
dance on the stage from the actor.

And it's, it's hard, man.

It's, it's so good at communicating
what Clint can't because

he is calloused and hiding.

I think what he's
actually feeling from the

Jude: outside, it's all those layers
and protection to get to his heart.

Yeah.

Cause he has poor branding.

Um, no, like what it
really reminded me of was.

Avatar the last Airbender, when they're
hiding out on Ember island and they

go watch the Ember island players.

The third to last episode, I
think of the entire series.

And they're watching the Ember
island players do a play of them.

And they're like, that's
not what I look like.

Is it?

I don't act this way too.

And then they're like,
the play must be over.

They caught up to.

Where we are now and it keeps going
and it shows, you know what the

screenwriters, I'm going to say this.

Cause I don't want to spoil
this cause it's one of the

best episodes of the series.

And that's saying something because
last time I ever tried last year,

bender is a fantastic series.

Actually.

I'm just gonna go out on that limb.

I think it's the best cartoon.

Cartoons period.

Um, oh man, that's tough.

That's tough.

Well, we haven't seen what I've
come to is completion and not enough

can never come to its completion
because of the multi-verse.

Um, you know, so at least the last
Airbender is in a contained space.

Um, but yeah, like it it's just, and
you see those characters kind of seeing

themselves and they're just like, what?

So yeah, this was
reminded me a lot of that.

Trey: That's a really good call.

Yeah.

It's different because I think
from what I remember that one was

played more for comedic effect.

I know there is meaning to be derived
from it, but it is more humorous.

And this one I think, was used
to show where Clint's at, but I'm

so glad you made that connection.

Jude: Well, yeah, I mean, this is Disney.

And MCU, PG 13, you know, the
other one was a Nickelodeon show

free with a demographic of kids.

Although if you watch it, they
did a really good job of tackling

some things for a kid show.

Trey: So I have one more
question about the musical.

Why did they go?

Like who was the driving force
for them going to that musical?

Because it didn't seem like the
kids were all that interested.

Clearly.

Clint was not in the right head space.

That seemed like an interesting
choice on the Barton's

Jude: family.

I think it was one of those things where
it's like we're in New York or doing New

York things as tourist at Christmas time.

What do you do?

You go see a musical.

I'm not familiar enough with New York.

So we'll have to ask around.

It felt off-Broadway rather
than actually on Broadway.

I don't know, you know, in terms of like
musical house and theater house and stuff,

uh, just looking at the setting, but
I don't know enough to like, recognize

like what they were trying to, to show.

Cause I think at the theater musical
theater world, that that actually

makes a difference, you know,
in terms of prestige and stuff.

Again, I'm way out of my depth here.

That's to my very vague
knowledge of, of that.

Uh, so I had to ask around and check
cause it, cause it does it, it would

convey a particular, uh, messages.

Well, depending on where it's at, uh, that
I just don't know, but I would, that's

my guess is they're doing the touristy.

Trey: I gotcha.

That makes, and that makes sense
because they even have that like,

all right, we're in New York, it's
Christmas, what do you want to do?

Hey, let's go see the Christmas tree.

And so like, they are checking off
lists of things to do together as a

Jude: family.

It's a list of things to
do and you check them off.

Yeah.

That's a very terrible
way to look at Christmas.

I just about to

Trey: say, you know, it's a little
divorced from the emotion and the

sincerity, but I get it in essence.

That's what it is.

You know, I want to say, I
love the Barton family so much.

Like I, you know, you brought up earlier.

Well, they all are the same, pretty much.

Jude: We have Christmas.

They are.

It's a wonderful life.

How the Grinch stole
Christmas and diehard.

Exactly the same stuff.

Trey: Diehard is the exception.

It's like everything sucks.

Oh, we found her holiday spirit.

Everything's

Jude: better.

It does follow the Christmas formula.

See

everything sucks.

John McClain with

everything's better.

Trey: That's American style.

Oh man.

We got to do a Christmas
day theme somehow kidding.

Oh my God.

I don't know if you heard my point.

I just wanted to say I'm so glad
you brought up that the title of

that review was Hawkeye superpowers.

Being a dad.

Jeremy Renner does such a great job of
creating that loving father persona.

He, he has created a family unit that
is believable on the screen, I think.

Jude: Well, okay.

The LARPing scene was fantastic.

Wait that's episode 10 episode two.

Trey: Okay.

That's fine.

Hey, this is what in the business we call
a tease stick around for our next episode.

Yes, but if you, if you want
to make your point, go ahead.

I mean, at this point, I

Jude: think I'm going to hang on to it.

That's a tease.

Okay.

You'll find episode.

Trey: You know what, with all that being
said, now that we have detailed the

characterization of Kate Bishop, the
characterization of Clint Barton, that's

going to bring us into our next most
important topic, which is hero admiration.

There is a theme within this episode
where we are seeing a theme between

these two characters in the way that
they have experienced here admiration.

So we want to take this time
in this section to detail that.

So Jude, is there anywhere you'd
like to start in this section?

Jude: Yes.

I found it interesting.

The contrast between Hawkeye and
Falcon and the winter soldier,

both textually and extra textual.

How so?

Whereas in text Falcon that winter
soldier, Sam couldn't get alone, but

Barton has like his expensive meal
paid for, for saving the city and.

So in MCU world, those are two
very different reactions to two

Avengers and extra textural.

How the show runners and writers decided
to portray those characters, like in

Falcon, in the winter soldier, we're
going to take the route of, yeah.

I don't care that your hero was real
world's real world and let's play up.

I play up not the right word, but
let's tackle our, just be honest

about race and ramifications.

Um, whereas this is a portrayal of
this hero admiration in this from,

from a city for being part of this,
um, the 2012 attack on New York.

And so I thought it was really
interesting that to, to have those

two, to kind of contrast those.

Trey: Yeah, 100%.

It makes me wonder if it
was intentional or not.

Like if there was any coordination
between creative teams in the way

that they have depicted these scenes.

Cause it.

Say a lot about the troubles that
Sam faced in trying to get that loan

and how far the status of his, his
Avenger status got him versus what

we see happen here with Hawkeye,
um, repeatedly within this episode.

Um, and I don't know, I don't know if
we'll ever get an answer about that, but

they are saying a lot intentional or not.

Right.

Jude: Well, and you have an element of
Sam not enjoying it, but like he enjoyed

it, you know, it's like, yeah, I'm a
hot guy, just a little bird flap with

his hand, not Hawkeye Falcon, they both
birds, but you know what, he does a little

hand flap with his hand, but like, like
there's an element of him embracing it.

Um, whereas like Clint is Hawkeye is
really just trying to be like, no,

like I, you don't have to do this.

And, and, and I don't want to say humble
and arrogant because I don't think.

Sam was arrogant about it in any
way, you know, I think it was like,

honestly, I think it was this weird
space of this, a good space, but a

weird space of this proper pride, right?

Like, like I'm not being arrogant,
but I'm not being humble.

Yeah.

Cause I did that.

You know what I mean?

Um, whereas clinch just like
now it's a day, it's a day at

the office, leave me alone.

Um, and, and so, so it's two very
different ways to portray that,

uh, from a character standpoint.

Um, and I, and I think it's fine.

Right.

And there different characters they're
going to handle it differently.

So that's why I say like textually
it's interesting, but I found it

more interesting of how the, the
outside world treating an Avenger,

you know, and, and that has, that's
a conscious choice on the writers

and showrunners and you know, what.

That like you run into an Avenger and you
want a selfie, but celebrities have been

around a long time before the Avengers
showed up, asking someone for a selfie

urinal like that should you should
just know that that's not what you do.

So

Trey: this, obviously this is not my
story, but I'm a big fan of rooster teeth.

One of the podcast hosts, it's
an internet celebrity, Gus

Serola 100% had this experience.

He talked about somebody following
them into the bathroom, asking for

a photo or a signature or something
and how creeped out he was by that.

So this happens and it's so weird.

So, so

Jude: weird.

The last time I did something like
that was, it was really weird.

Um,

Trey: you really got to set this up
quicker cause you can't just say the last

time I did that after setting up, going
into the bathroom, asking somebody for

Jude: an audit.

Yeah, no, I, it just dawned on me, as I
said that the last time I did something

like that, that meaning approaching.

Um, what would made it
awkward on a hundred percent?

What made it awkward was it's the summer
of like, like we're talking July, maybe

August, somewhere in there of 2020.

So when you, when you think about COVID
and where we're at, I'm out in public and

I get the opportunity to meet this person
and I'm just like, do I say something?

Do I not I'm wearing a mask.

He's not like, you know what I mean?

And so, yeah.

So that's one of the things
that made it awkward.

Now I'm a hundred percent honest.

Like I was like, yeah, COVID be damned.

I'm going to go up and
ask him to shake his hand.

I'm not going to go into the complete
details why, but, but, and I had, my,

my reasons were, it was just like,
okay, so I'm going to do this anyways.

Um, but it was, it was awkward.

It was just like, even in the normal
just stores, like you're here shopping.

I happen to walk into the
right store at the right time.

Yeah.

You know,

Trey: can you say who it was or no.

Were you trying to dance around that?

Jude: I will say this.

Cause I, I think, I think if
I say who it was, it's might

be a little too much location.

Okay.

Thanks.

But I will say it was a
1970s cowboy Dallas cowboy.

Oh, okay.

Trey: Okay.

I'll say that.

Okay.

That's fine.

I won't prod.

Did I ever tell you about where I
learned to swear off ever asking to

meet somebody I admire is a celebrity.

No.

Jude: I

Trey: got God, this is embarrassing.

I got the chance to meet Dan Harmon

Jude: told me about this.

I have, yeah.

Trey: Oh God.

So I had the chance to meet him.

He did a show in Houston for his podcast
called Harmontown and it was just

after God, this gets so much worse.

It was just after I had completed a, of
a script that I was writing and the whole

reason I had like the inspiration to
continue, it was because of community and

finding his, his, uh, books on writing,
where he basically distilled the hero's

journey into an even simplified form.

So he, he was a huge inspiration.

And so as he was finishing the show,
he was standing to the side, getting

autographs and pictures and whatnot.

And I got in line.

And I had that script with me
was not going to give it to him.

I just wanted him to sign it as like,
you know, and say, Hey, like, thanks

for, for being you without you.

I never would have finished this.

And this means a lot to me, even
if it goes nowhere, what happened

is I got up there and I was so
nervous and I was like, I love you.

And I'm nothing without you.

And there was just this really
awkward, awkward feeling.

And he took the script and he
wrote nice title, psych Tim Harmon.

And I was just like dead

Jude: for weeks.

Well, you know, if something like that
happened, In any of his stuff since

then, the inspiration for that scene.

Trey: I got to find a picture of
that script and take a picture of it.

Cause I just have nice title psych Dan.

Yes, please

Jude: do that.

So, no, I will, I will say this.

It was, it was a couple of weeks after
my stepdad had passed away and my

stepdad was a huge fan of this person.

And so it was one of those things
where it's like, I, I have to ask, you

know, uh, did you say hi, I recognize
that you shake your hand, you know?

Um, cause it was just, the timing was.

Just right.

If that, if that makes sense.

Um, so yeah, you know, um, and then
awkwardly again, I work at a private

school, so there's like parents of like
famous kids locally, or like, not the

kids aren't famous, but like their parents
are locally that go there and like parent

teacher conference comes around and then
there's an element of like, you're famous.

Great.

But kidney's turned into his work.

Uh, you know, it's like, it's like
you see them on a level of like,

like you're used to seeing them as a
celebrity when you see them on a level

of like, at the time a parent teacher
conference with this person, I like the

kid with the kid won't turn in work.

Um, it makes it so much
easier when their kid does

Trey: the example of the, the rich
and the young thinking they're

Jude: so, yeah.

You know, now.

It's not difficult to separate
like in the classroom completely,

not just professional.

Well, not even that, you know, I mean,
there's an element of, um, I, I don't

want to get too far off track here,
but there is an element of like, even

with the kids, you know, even, even
with the NOC kids, with the non-famous

parents, if that makes sense that have.

And an older sibling that
comes through the school.

It's like, I try to make this separation
of like, you're your own person.

You're not in your
sibling shadow, you know?

And so I might ask once and the
first day, oh, you're related to this

person, how are they doing in college?

You know?

Um, because I teach upperclassmen
and after that, I'm like, let it go.

Um, yeah, but there's so many times
that like, I didn't even know that

kid's parents were like a celebrity
until parent teacher conferences.

They come like literally one time, I was
like, oh dude, look, he's walking around.

And like 20 minutes later, he's coming in.

Oh, it didn't put together
the child's last name for

the same, like I had no idea.

Uh, so yeah, so it's, it's
not actually hard to do.

Um, and, but again, there's this
weird awkwardness there too, so,

Trey: well, you know, speaking
of the weird awkwardness.

I want to circle back to the episode
where I can detail the core of what I

like about Clint and Kate's dynamics
so far, you know, we've detailed the

awkwardness that came from the fan
who wanted the, um, the autograph in

the, or the selfie in the bathroom.

We talked about how Clint was trying
to have a normal family dinner and

he couldn't even get away from it.

There it's such an interesting dynamic
that we see the flip side of that,

where Kate was inspired by Hawkeye's
actions in a more sincere way.

There's not novelty to it in a way.

Which I'll cut some slack to the waiter.

Maybe it's just a restaurant
that wants to do like, Hey,

you know, you saved our city.

Thanks.

But there's a novelty.

I think what the person who just
wants to selfie cause at the end of

the day, you know, what's, it's just
proof that you saw that person, but

for Kate, it is real inspiration.

And what Clint is wrestling with here
is that the legend has out shined

the reality, which is always a very
interesting place, I think, for the heroes

to play in just like an a on a meta level.

And that is the defense mechanism that
is keeping Kate at bay from Clint or

Clint, keeping Kate at bay, I should
say that's a better way to phrase that.

And so that's just such a great dynamic
for them to work together through.

Jude: Yeah.

With Ms.

Marvel.

I just want to, I know this is,
trust me, this isn't off topic.

Uh, there's a YouTube channel that I
really like a lot called nerd sync.

Um, and he has.

This thing on Ms.

Marvel, that and the Ms.

Marvel comics.

Fantastic.

And I like seeing the MCU playing with
this in, in this space with Clint.

Um, and again, like a little bit with
Sam green has this whole video on miss

Marvel and parasocial relationships.

This idea that you have a relationship
with somebody you don't know

through that interaction through.

Interaction through social media or
just simply watching them, um, some

pair of social relationships, uh, like
watching them on YouTube or watching

them through movies and interviews,
Ted Harmon, you know, like some kind of

content and you feel like, you know them,
um, it works for like Gandalf, right?

Like I read these books over and over
and I feel like Gandalf's my mentor.

Dumbledore is my mentor, Sirius black.

Obiwan like insert that there.

And it can be a healthy
thing, this escapism.

Right.

And having that, that peer
social type relationship.

Um, but it can also be unhealthy.

And in some ways, when it's a real
life person and then you get to

meet them because you've been,
you've built them up and like that,

that's one of the things that Ms.

Marvel.

Uh, Kamala Khan does and Russell's with,
and the comic as a fan of superheroes.

And so I really like, and I can
give you the link, so we make

sure that's in the show notes.

It's a really good video, but I like that.

Um, that's what they're wrestling with.

Right?

You have these elements of like,
and I wasn't trying to call out

the waiter or the restaurant owner.

Cause there's an element of
like, this is your business.

You did this for the city on the house.

Like I get that.

That's pretty, that's pretty appropriate.

But then you have the other reaction
of, oh my gosh, it's you let

me take a selfie kind of thing.

Um, we're definitely calling that out.

Yeah.

And, but, but they showed both ends,
like the more subtle kind of, Hey,

you saved the city and my business.

Yeah.

You know, to the like cool fan boy moment
that like, I might get caught up in.

If I, you know, it's like,
oh my gosh, you're Paul Rudd.

You know, take a, take a screenshot,
the sexiest man alive, apparently

at the time of this recording,
according to time magazine.

So

Trey: let's make sure we got that.

Jude: Yeah, but I mean, like he
might have that kind of reaction.

Um, you know, and so I liked that they
gave us both ends of that spectrum.

Yeah.

For you'd be Chris Evans.

Trey: Oh one nine.

The percent that I might break
my rule for captain America.

Yeah.

Jude: It's T for that, I was,
I was, I would say I was saving

this for straight thoughts.

I was going to say it right now.

I really want to see a live
reaction video of Chris Evans

watching that musical number.

Trey: Yes.

That has to happen, right?

No.

He's probably distancing, distancing
himself from the MC for the

Jude: time being at Chris Evans
at Twitter, we'll tweet out.

Trey: We just talked about Paris halls.

Oh

Jude: man.

Well, that was a doozy.

You know what?

You're right.

I don't know.

Chris.

I'll get in touch with Kevin.

Trey: Yeah.

Yeah.

That's the, we'll talk to you.

I'll mention it in the Christmas card.

Well, I think that's going to wrap
up the hero admiration section, which

is going to bring us to our last most
important topic, which is the auction.

So this is going to really detail
everything going on with the black

market auction, the ensuing action set
pieces through the discovery of our

month's death and the end of the episode
where Clint and Kate finally meet up.

So starting with me this time.

I just really want to highlight how
resourceful Kate is, especially as

somebody like they did such a great job
of showing well, they did it through

the opening title credits, where they
showed her through all those training

montages, all the trophy, she was
winning, all the things that she's

been doing since she was a little girl.

She is somebody that has trained after
being spurned from the 2012 events.

So it isn't a surprise that she
handles herself so well, both in

combat and installed, but it is really
fun to watch the way that she uses

her tuxedo as a way to blend in with
all the other waiters or is able to.

Stay cool in the moment and
flip the distraction onto

people who have caught her.

So for example, whenever she gets
caught by Gary and she's like,

that's the problem, Gary, I quit.

And she just walks away.

She's such a great, great
character in this MCU.

Jude: It's so resourceful.

It's like, yeah, it's, that's another
sequence where we learned a lot.

And it's interesting.

Cause cause you have that, the typical
shot of like in the beginning of

like, oh, here's all your trophies
and here's your other metal and,

and, and how the metal was meeting.

You know, it's like,
look, here's another one.

And the younger ones is the one
that, that she was really proud of.

And that one scene when she came home
from college, but that sequence was great

because they showed the resourcefulness
of being able to get back there.

This that's the problem, Gary,
you don't even know my name.

I'm like, you can just see that, like,
it wasn't just like the training.

She was self-training, but it
was really to be at Avenger.

It wasn't just like, I want
to know how to shoot a bow and

arrow, or I want to do this.

Like it, like, it was actual like
something she was able to put

to use, which was really cool.

Trey: Yeah.

I think that's a great way to put it.

It isn't just, these are interests.

She has, she has this feeling.

I need to protect the people I love.

Like that was her origin
story at the beginning.

Opening.

And it's on display

Jude: now.

And the sequence was fantastic.

Like they had Carol, the bells
playing in the background.

So you still have that Christmas
feeling and holiday feel, but Carol

of the bells and the version they
were playing of, it gave it this

sense of tension and suspense as well.

She was following her mind, um,
the third and that's important.

Yeah.

Well, we gotta keep, I was
wondering if it's, if that was

like Armand, the third is Trey.

Yeah.

Why don't we call him on the seventh?

I mean, clearly in their
family, it's just Armand.

What is it like?

And anyways, um, I'm just,
just anyways, I'm just curious.

Trey: I'm I'm I'm trying to figure out
what do you call the seventh enough?

Jude: Enough that's enough.

Oh my gosh.

Oh my gosh.

That secrets really guts.

You did.

Okay, I'm sorry.

No, I mean, the SQL was really good.

We learned more about Kate her.

We're able to see that the training was
able to put it into some kind of action.

Uh, we get to see how capable she is.

Um, you know, and, and to be honest,
like, oh, this whole episode,

and I could see why they, they,
they dropped two in the same.

It was, was a lot of setup at this time.

Yeah.

You know, I mean, both in establishing
who these characters are individually

and where they're at, but also stuff
that, you know, well, we hope is going

to be paid off in the next four episodes.

Trey: So, you know, shifting gears here
in this auction section, I don't know

if maybe you have some speculations,
but we don't have enough textual

evidence, but where do you think they're
getting this stuff for the auction?

Because it's some pretty like, was
there no one guarding the Avengers

compound after in game because that's
some pretty high classified stuff.

You had the Ronan suit, you had the
sword and you had the watch, which is

from the Avengers compound as well.

I didn't, I got this from Reddit.

People were speculating that maybe it
was Tony's watch, I think from civil war

that he used to defend himself against
Bucky, how are they getting a hold

Jude: of all of this?

That's interesting.

I didn't think of the watch because one
of my notes was who's doing the wrong.

I don't think that's clear yet.

They were looking for a watch what watch,
but also in particular, my thought, my

position, I'm just going to read from
my note that talking about the sword

and Ronan suit that should have been
with the department of damage control.

So who did this auction?

And like, like you said, how
did they get their hands on?

It was this like an inside job.

Because as far as I understand,
you know, this department of

damage control, that wreckage stuff
should have went to them, right.

Trey: Dealing under the table.

Jude: And what's the skull.

Like I just, I just took the skull.

Like the watch has to be something,
cause you specifically hear the dialogue

and they were breaking into this.

So I'm really hoping that it was
something and not just a momentarily

MacGuffin just to show off her skills.

Right.

And, uh, and to set off the quest
of, of getting the suit back,

um, which it was interesting.

Cause it was all enough to suit Barton.

Didn't know about the sword.

Oh yeah.

He didn't, he was always
looking for the suit.

He didn't know about the sword.

So I think he's, you know, he
will find out about the sword

I'm assuming, but, and so like, I
didn't think much about the watch.

I just thought it was like,
oh, we had some random skull.

Why are they looking for the watch?

What is the watch?

Um, But it was very specific
dialogue, so that's probably

gonna mean something later.

Um, yeah, I'd imagine.

Okay.

I have, I have my speculation
now on who's doing all this.

I got it.

Go ahead.

Do I do it now or do I wait?

It's

Trey: up to you.

I know we're not doing predictions
until episode two, but if you want to

throw it in now you can dealer's choice.

I

Jude: am going to do my second
tease for episode of who I think is

behind the robbery or if not, the.

And not the robbery actually, let me be
clear, not behind the robbery, but behind

who was able to get the stuff for auction.

Okay.

Trey: Well, I just want to clarify
the robbery was the tracksuit

mafia, because they were saying
bro, a lot before that door

Jude: open.

See, I didn't, I didn't get that,
that, that was the tracksuit

Trey: mafia.

And I think one of them lifts
the mask, I guess, I guess so.

Jude: Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

I didn't get to the robbery was
from what I saw the tracksuit mafia,

the robbery felt too sophisticated,

so that's hard to think why.

I don't think that that's
why I put those two together.

Trey: Oh, that's fantastic.

Well, we'll, we'll get to those
teases in the next recording.

Uh, circling.

We've got to talk about our Monda third's
death, all signs in my opinion, are

pointing towards Jack as the killer,
but gathering my grains of sand.

I don't know if I want to believe it
because it feels a little too obvious.

Are you out there with
me on this sand hill?

Or am I alone?

I can lay out my reasonings.

Jude: It's it's definitely
a small hill at this point.

Cause, cause it's one of those things.

I'm not sure if they are misdirecting
with the obvious or again, the problem

I think of having six episodes versus
eight I've, we've seen two of six episodes

now in terms of being economical, we
got to get things moving, you know?

And so it feels like
an obvious assumption.

So for example, one of my notes,
again, I'm going to get and use

this now rather than stray thoughts
was for me, it wasn't clear.

Um, why Kate didn't like Jack?

Um, I know he's creepy and I
know we're supposed to feel that

he's creepy, but I didn't get it.

We don't know enough of that
relationship that like, clearly

she knew Jack and doesn't approve
of this marriage and this person.

And, but I don't know.

Yeah.

Like I I've had the point
of view of Kate it's.

I don't know why, if that makes sense.

And so in that sense, like I'm
trusting as a viewer, I have to

trust Kate and through Kate's eyes,
he suspicious, he likes swords.

This person was.

Um, killed by a sword and we
have the knowledge that, um,

I, what was I going to say?

Uh, oh, the Jack links sorts.

Yeah.

You know, so in that sense, like
it can be setting us up for Mr.

Lee and Mr.

Action, or it could be just,
Hey, what's the most economical

way to get through this?

Trey: It's the PowerBroker problem
where, or maybe I shouldn't say problem.

Cause I guess it did work for
some people, but it's where we,

we spent the whole scenes, like, I
don't know, it seems too obvious.

And we got the hinges like, well, I guess
it was the obvious, like sometimes it

Jude: just is that.

Yeah.

And, and we felt like they missed
out on doing some things with the

PowerBroker for the sake of the surprise
that they didn't hide very well.

Yeah.

And it, and it makes you wonder what
Jack, like, which is this going to be.

Trey: So I'll lay out my reasoning
and I'll play off by what you said

about the point of view of Kate.

I think it is because of the point
of view of Kate that I'm leaning

towards Jack not being as suspicious
as they want to want us to believe.

Just because I think the tension is coming
from the new stepdad, um, antagonism

that could be fairly or unfairly
placed upon him from her perspective.

And it almost feels in that
Spider-Man homecoming way of like,

Hey, you know, I got the bad guys,
I gotta just catch them, do this.

And then, you know,
it's as simple as that.

And then he stumbles into the very,
and realizes that it was an FBI sting

operation and he just kinda ended up
like messing up the whole thing, but

he jumped the gun with his evidence.

And that's what it feels
like with Kate here.

And so the ways in which they are prodding
us about Jack being the suspect here

is, you know, he makes the joke about
the inheritance with Armanda third.

Uh, there's some very high tension.

Uh, the sword, as they're
both trying to bid for it.

And then the, the motive with
Armanda third threatening his fiance,

Eleanor, that seems like a probable
cause for wanting to do that.

But there's one scene and member, when
I said, hold on until I get to some

predictions where it may seem like
my point about Eleanor's moot when we

see Eleanor and Armanda third arguing,
we come in when our mind says I've

got powerful friends too, you know?

And so what we didn't hear in
what I'm assuming is Eleanor

was threatening him as well.

So, because that seems like a very, that
seems like a response to a threat to me.

Yes.

Jude: I don't know.

Trey: So I'm thinking Eleanor
is going to be our switcheroo

Jude: here.

Yeah.

Well, and they want it even they're
like you were outside of the room,

like you said, you had Kate Bishop's
point of view, but even the camera was

set up to where you couldn't see them.

Clearly.

It was like kinda the door was halfway.

Um, so you were clearly only meant to hear
half of a conversation, both like audibly

and visually you only got half of it.

Trey: Um, so the last thing I want to
bring up before we get out of this section

is there's a moment after the explosion,
after Kate has put on the Ronan suit

where our mind, the third and Jack are
being held up, I think, and Ronin stumbles

in and Jack gets a clear look at the
Ronan, but you can only see their eyes.

Do you think Jack
recognized Kate in the seat?

I'm going to say, yes, he did.

That makes, and that, and it's funny,
I'm bringing this up cause I just laid

out a whole case for why I don't think
Jack is going to be as a suspect as he

is, but it does make it very suspicious
if he recognized Kate that eventually he

meets up with Eleanor and she asks where's
Kate and he's like, oh, I don't know.

So, so there's, there's a
lot of suspicious activity

happening in this one scene.

Jude: Yeah.

I, I

Trey: think I poured a
water on my own sandcastle.

Jude: I'm going to say.

Again, episode two, like these
clearly these episodes go together.

There's a moment in episode two.

That, that drives me to say yes.

Trey: Okay.

Okay.

Well, you know what, with that being
said, why don't we go ahead and get

into stray thoughts so we can wrap up
this episode and get into episode two.

All right.

Sounds good.

So if you are new to our show, uh, this
section is essentially for us to throw

out any stray thoughts we had, that didn't
quite fit into the most important topics.

Uh, so Jude starting with
you, what are your stray?

Jude: Uh, I do want to say I'm
demonstrate straight thoughts.

I'd like to use of the first of
injust footage back in the beginning.

Um, clearly noticed the theme when she's
watching from the, from the balcony.

It wasn't really balcony.

It was, uh, a new balcony,
I guess, from the damage.

Um, it's under renovation.

Yeah.

But it was the whole theme song had
hints of Alan sylvestris Avengers

theme, but it was also different because
it was Hawkeye, you know, so, yeah.

So I really liked that.

Use their, um, I thought they did
a really good job of subverting

expectations from the trailer.

Cause in the trailer, we do see
the arrow shot, um, to the, to

the bell tower and the bell ring.

And it's because of the suit she's
wearing and everything, it feels like

at that point, she's already hooked
up with Hawkeye as a hero and doing

stuff, you know, or in that's part of
something like a distraction maybe that

they're doing like for the trailer.

And so the way they were able to use
that in the trailer and make you feel one

thing, but do something different with it
in the show, I thought it was really good.

Um, I loved the opening credits.

Really.

It felt very Netflix.

It felt Daredevil Netflix and Netflix
in general because Netflix shows their

opening credits have a particular style,
um, that are different than other shows.

On other streaming services, I
feel like, and this one I just

thought was really well done.

And I love that the, the graphic
art was very in line with now.

I haven't read the Hawkeye comics
that this is referring to yet.

I really want to, but at this point I will
probably finish these episodes before.

Um, in fact, Tara has.

Uh, TK on, uh, there was an idea, a
podcast has her review of, of those runs.

And I haven't listened to that
yet because I want to go ahead

and get through the show first.

Um, so in four more weeks, um,

Trey: yeah, yeah.

Between, between TK and
friend Daniel hyping up the

Matt fraction run of Hawkeye.

So highly I'm 100% gonna read it after.

Jude: Oh yeah.

Same, same.

But I do know stylistically the graphics
really stuck with the comic look and

that, and I'm really pleased by that.

Yeah.

So that's my stray thoughts.

What about you?

Trey: So, uh, starting back at the
beginning 2012 perspective, I just want

to say this Kate's dad looks like a cross
between Colin Farrell and Steven Seagal.

And it's very funny to me, a second
stray thoughts before Clint recognized

the suit in that news broadcast, where
it was like, we have another mask to

save blood running through New York.

Do you think he was
like, oh man, here we go.

Here's another Avenger.

Like, is it just like a dime a
dozen for them at this point that

Jude: I have another year at this point?

Right?

I mean civil war.

What is it?

Everyone has a gimmick.

Yeah.

Oh man.

Trey: Uh, another strength.

Technically breaks are our
spoiler zone territory.

I'll cut it out.

If you, you, you have a chance to veto
this, but love that the new Marvel studios

fanfare is the exact same one they used
in the internals, which shots from I

think black widows in there as well.

Uh, really cool.

That that has been updated, um, really
enjoyed the nod to of course, internet

culture, where they had the Thanos
was right written on the urinal.

Oh yes.

Uh, two more.

The most unrealistic thing that I have
ever seen in the MCU is that Kate was able

to tight while wearing the Ronin gloves.

She typed so flawlessly on that cell
phone and it, the whole time I was like,

there's no way like even phones that
is saying, oh, it has capacitive touch.

Don't work.

Jude: What I find interesting
about what you just said.

And I think, you know, what I find
interesting about what you just said

is that being the most realistic,
unrealistic thing you've ever

seen the MCU, which means what?

No, go ahead.

No, I'm going to just curious.

What was it?

Oh four.

No, no,

Trey: I'm never going to escape it.

Emma escape.

What?

Jude: I don't understand.

I was trying to make a point
and you're just like, ah, Oh, I

knew I could get you to say it.

So I

Trey: know I was going to see
who was going to break first.

Jude: Yeah.

Like, like you were so down on the
truck moment on his hero moment.

I wish you liked him.

I wish you like captain America.

Um, I do

Trey: like Katherine,
man, we can't do this.

We got new people.

This is a chance to act

Jude: cool that you just draw the
line on like Sam being a hero in

Kate Middleton type of gloves.

I get it.

I just, I'm trying to figure out what,
how those are the equivalent, but okay.

Trey: Last thought we need MC
you need to know butterscotch.

So that's going to wrap
it up for this episode.

Usually the way that we handle
this is this is where we would read

the audience's first take as well.

But given that we are doing back-to-back
episodes, we're going to go ahead and

save all those first reactions for the
upcoming episode that is in the feed.

We also do predictions for the next
episode, but given the two episode drop,

that's not something that we can do here.

So instead I will say, if you enjoyed
this episode, uh, you should definitely

be following us on social media
where you can reach us at MCU need

to know on Twitter and Instagram.

Uh, it is a great place to get
bonus content that does not make

the final cut of the episode.

So we have in tags, whatever Intacct
doesn't get used, we will put up

on there as well as quicker access
to what we thought of the episodes

before our Monday episode drop.

So if any of those are interesting
to you, you should definitely

give us a follow and help us out

Jude: there.

And of course, let's take that
a step further when you're in

the show notes, you can click on
the link and join our discord.

Uh, wonderful community of people in
interested in all kinds of things,

but also in particular, the MCU, when
you get there, make sure you click

on the role, assign channel, click
on the emoji and that'll get you

access to all the spoiler channels.

And of course, since you're
listening to this episode, I'm

going to make the assumption.

You enjoy it.

If you got to this point, share that
joy holiday season with a friend.

Trey: Yeah.

We'd also like to thank Nick Sandy for
the use of our theme song, which is

his rendition of the Avengers theme.

You find more of his work on
his SoundCloud, which has linked

in the show notes as well.

That's going to do it.

Thank you so much for
listening and Judy booty.

Thank you so much for doing this.

Thank

Jude: you, Trey.

Trey: See you all next week.

Oh man.

I was so weighted to Trop
that ever since I heard

Jude: Jamie, I was like, I
cannot believe you left that in.

No.

Trey: Oh man.

You have no idea how hard I was
struggling to keep a straight

face all the way through.

Jude: So, you know what?

I can't do what's best for the pod and
it seem like leaving that in there.

So it was best for the pod.

Oh, it was definitely
good for the pod mice.

Okay.

So I don't have any notes for episode two.

Oh, I've watched it two and a half times.

That third time I was
supposed to be taking notes.

I fell asleep on the couch.

No.

Um, but I have seen it
two and a half times.

Wow.

Trey: Uh, I was going to

Jude: say it's giving
man, like no, no, no,

Trey: I'm not.

I'm not throwing any shade.

I was just going to say, I was
going to tell you, I feel my

episode two notes are weaker.

So this is going to be very interesting.

Once we get to episode two.

Oh, I can't wait.